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Thread: Anal Sacculectomy / Sterlization / Anesthetic freak out

  1. #1
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    Anal Sacculectomy / Sterlization / Anesthetic freak out

    Pips is having a surgery day on he 19th December - a 3 in one due to Frenchie's anesthetic risks :
    • Anal Sacculectomy
    • Sterlization
    • Removal of a little tag on her lip


    I am freaking out! Because of the anesthetic risk, because this won't be performed by our normal vet and the specialist seems very 'business only', because I'm second guessing the need for the Anal Sacculectomy and because of the pain and recovery my poor baby will go through for at least two weeks after.

    Has anyone here had Frenchies who have had any of the surgeries??? Please can you provide some insight into the after surgery part and success?

    She needs to be steralized as per her breeder & daycare contract but the lip tag is purely cosmetic (although it will be sent for testing). Her butt leaks almost daily as she has never been able to naturally express but I haven't seen her scooting for a couple of weeks. I know this is just my worry getting the better of me as I know she is uncomfortable and also seems embarrassed when she leaks, on top of the removal being her vet's recommendation, but I am second guessing the need for removal.

    Please tell me about your experiences with these 3 surgeries and your Frenchies on anesthetic in general

  2. #2
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    Re: Anal Sacculectomy / Sterlization / Anesthetic freak out

    Hi,
    I understand your worry about having Pippa go under anesthesia.
    We have had frenchies and Pekes spayed and neutered without incidence.
    Our pug went under for a tooth removal and teeth cleaning. No problems whatsoever. (Yes we love the smush faces)
    Having a vet that you feel good about is important. It helps to ease your nerves....some.
    You will still worry. You are not alone.
    We have been fortunate to have had and currently have a vet that is very knowledgeable about the "bully" breeds.
    Having said that, we still worry when they've had to go under.
    What is amazing is how quickly these little guys rebound from surgery. They are amazing.
    Sending good thoughts to you and Pippa.

  3. #3
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    Re: Anal Sacculectomy / Sterlization / Anesthetic freak out

    Your worry is warranted since this is not your normal vet , my guy has been through many surgeries (about 5) without any issues at all. all of his recoveries .. the hardest was keeping him calm during the recovery period. After one day of 'rest', he was up and ready to run, jump and play within 48 hours.

    We will be sending lots of positive thoughts to you all on the day of surgery. please keep us posted.

    my sweet angel babies
    Nitschke 2004-2011 and Banks 2005-2014

  4. #4
    Senior Member Frenchie Grrrl's Avatar
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    Re: Anal Sacculectomy / Sterlization / Anesthetic freak out

    Is there a date by which you are required to get her spayed? If you are unsure if she really needs surgery for the anal gland issues, is there harm in waiting? Based on your other thread, and all the allergy issues that she's been having, as well, I'd look into putting her on a raw, grain free (possibly starch free) diet. I'd just want to try that before heading into surgery.

    That's probably not what you wanted to hear, and probably why I'm still shopping around for a vet. I just think too many push these "quick fix" solutions to address the symptom, rather than trying to find out what the underling issue is. Not sure I'd trust the opinion of a vet that would push that "prescription" food on a dog. (Sorry, combining threads).

    Anyway, it sounds to me like she has bad autoimmune issues. Maybe all her issues are related to an unhealthy gut.

    Worry is normal, but if you don't feel right about the anal gland surgery, I would do some more research, if time is not a huge issue.

  5. #5
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    Re: Anal Sacculectomy / Sterlization / Anesthetic freak out

    Thank you for putting my mind at ease, I do appreciate it and insight on your experiences!

    The problem is there is literally only one veterinary surgeon and one animal anesthetist in South Africa So as uncomfortable I am with not knowing them and them treating her more as a number rather than as 'Pippa' as her normal vet would, we don't have another option.

    Her daycare contract states sterilization at 6 months, and her breeder's contract at 10 months. Her primary vet is happy for hers to commence now (6.5 months), as well as her second after-hours vet we've been to a few times. I have been playing this over and over with my husband because we can deal with the gland issues if its not physically affecting her, however we have decided its best to put our concerns aside do all 3 at once at her vet's advice (regarding anesthetic and recovery period). Its definitely not something that will go away by itself or lessen on its own, besides the lip tag but that's the most minor. Frenchie Grrrl, have a look at my food thread and have a laugh that her test results show the main ingredient in the Hills is the only protein she's actually intolerant of haha. We are definitely weaning her off that as soon as she's recovered.

    I will try to find the time to keep a (almost) daily log during her recovery as I have only found one blog to reference and it was not Frenchie specific. Hopefully it will help another parent who is also feeling very lost and under-educated

  6. #6
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    Re: Anal Sacculectomy / Sterlization / Anesthetic freak out

    Best of luck to Pippa. Sending out good vibes to heal quickly.

  7. #7
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    Re: Anal Sacculectomy / Sterlization / Anesthetic freak out

    I mentioned I had a hard time finding info on the anal gland removal procedure and anything I did find was a bit hysterical or worst case scenario. So just in case anyone's pup will be having this surgery, I'm going to give a summary on how it went for Pippa and hopefully it will help put your mind at ease :

    Pips' 3 in 1 op took about 5 hours and the doctors and nurses were happy with how things were by the time it was done. In the evening when I called the nurse to check up as I was worried about her sleeping alone, she said she was resting very comfortably and there was nothing to worry about. The next day at pick up she had already eaten and taken her first poo and was very happy to see her dad and aunt (I unfortunately couldn't make it to pick up), from the pics I got that day she seemed quite groggy but there weren't any moans or cries or much sulking. When I got home I was quite taken aback to see my half naked child, she looked quite beat up after hearing how good she was feeling - full tummy and butt region shaved with a wet looking butt & lots of stitches all over including lip. But she was back to her zoomies, eating, pooping, jumping and chasing by that evening Before the end of week one she was going on half hour walks and going to visit family and running around insanely in their much bigger houses than ours. I do need to stress that Pippa has never been a moaner, crier or let on much when she is in pain - our experience has probably been best case scenario and hopefully yours will be too.

    The worst part was over the first+- 5 days there was a constant poop leakage and smell which followed her. Obviously since she couldn't wash for two weeks, some stayed on her skin no matter how many times we wiped her down. The possibility of this happening was definitely not stressed enough by the vet and I gave a one week grace period before I would have gone in for a follow up. On the fourth night I actually woke up to the smell of our skin, clothing, bed, pillows and headboard absolutely full of poop, that was the low point of the entire process, but from the next day all the leaking had stopped yay! Her dad spent a few nights on the couch during her recovery because we were scared of grazing her op sites if she was bunched in bed between us, and at some points the smells were just too hectic. She stopped her pain meds on day 5 and she was a bit depressed and sleepy but we were certain this was from the "come down" and not from pain. She has always been a fighter when taking meds so this was a twice daily struggle.

    We have always been babywipe wipers and tissue dryers when she poops so keeping things clean and sterile wasn't an issue for us. Once she winced a bit in pain on the first day home while we wiped but other than that, not a sound out of her. Even when we dabbed too hard or dislodged a scab or two our little soldier took it all in her stride. She has been so absolutely amazing and I can't be more proud of her. I really can't stress enough how great she has been and how easy we had it (her wanting to carry her toy around her body basically touching her spay site, multi-tasking single mom style, is on day two of being home).

    We were unable to keep her still and calm through the two week healing but nothing bad came from it which I think is a big concern for any parent having this surgery. And when I say she is active, I mean it... We also bypassed her daily teeth brushing and face wipe down for the first few days in case she fought us and got sore - this was a bad idea as she developed tear stains from missing a few nights. Other than that, I would suggest getting a waterproof mattress protector/plastic under the sheets if your pup sleeps in bed with you, LOTS of wipes, her favourite food and treats and a novel new toy that will keep her still and entertained and you will be good to go. We also got her steps up to the bed because there was no comfortable way of picking her up, which really helped her and made her feel very independent. If possible, I would suggest not changing her routine too much - if she sleeps in bed with you, don't crate her etc because that will cause a cycle of bad reactions. This seems obvious but in trying to find other people's experiences, I have read of many people doing this then wondering why their pup is crying when alone in a crate downstairs in the kitchen all night. I also ran out and got two sets of cheap bedding to get us through her recovery because we were going through our normal, pricier sheets like loo paper during the first few days (maybe add washing powder to that list...)

    Another thing we didn't feel was stressed by vet were the huge, thick scabs from the clamps on either side of her butt. We actually had no idea she would be clamped. These were a real eye sore & look terribly sore, given Pippa's skin issues we were so worried it was a reaction to something. On new years eve (about 1.5 weeks in) these fell off naturally and all that's left are two scars.

    On her 14th day, we popped via the vet and the nurse took her lip & spay stitches out (butt is dissolvable) and was happy with her progress. This was done at the back but must have been painful as our trooper came out shivering and wanting to be held and get the hell out that place. The good news is she got the go ahead to go back to daycare immediately after and the entire process has been forgotten ever since. Her hair is already all back On the behavioural side the only downer has been that she has gotten so used to seeing both dad & I within a few meters of her for two weeks that when we are in the next room and out of sight she goes on a huge barking spree and expects us to find her - she was never a big barker or expected us to find her (not her find us) before but she does have separation issues which I feel have now been reinforced since she obviously needed to be under our noses for two weeks. She has gotten better since going back to daycare so we are hoping it was just a phase.

    So we feel the operation has been worth it - no daily leaking, painful weekly expressions and no more scooting!!! She even made a friend with the other Frenchie having her spay the same morning and had a playdate this past weekend. Over the past week she has had what looks like a solid poop nugget, attached to her skin and all attempts to remove this has shown its quite attached to her and made her wince a bit. So I am calling the vet today and asking to come through for them to have a look and remove whatever it is. I am hoping it is not a messy stitching job that has caused a bit of skin to stick out beyond the sphincter. I am quite worried about this and the possibility of needing to go back under to have her skin snipped neatly (I am the worst worrier in the world). Other than that our little baby child has been better than ever and if your experience as been anything like ours, I would definitely recommend this procedure.

    (Please excuse the all-over-the-show typing)

  8. #8
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    Re: Anal Sacculectomy / Sterlization / Anesthetic freak out

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    Re: Anal Sacculectomy / Sterlization / Anesthetic freak out

    Quote Originally Posted by MomOfPippa View Post
    I mentioned I had a hard time finding info on the anal gland removal procedure and anything I did find was a bit hysterical or worst case scenario. So just in case anyone's pup will be having this surgery, I'm going to give a summary on how it went for Pippa and hopefully it will help put your mind at ease :

    Pips' 3 in 1 op took about 5 hours and the doctors and nurses were happy with how things were by the time it was done. In the evening when I called the nurse to check up as I was worried about her sleeping alone, she said she was resting very comfortably and there was nothing to worry about. The next day at pick up she had already eaten and taken her first poo and was very happy to see her dad and aunt (I unfortunately couldn't make it to pick up), from the pics I got that day she seemed quite groggy but there weren't any moans or cries or much sulking. When I got home I was quite taken aback to see my half naked child, she looked quite beat up after hearing how good she was feeling - full tummy and butt region shaved with a wet looking butt & lots of stitches all over including lip. But she was back to her zoomies, eating, pooping, jumping and chasing by that evening Before the end of week one she was going on half hour walks and going to visit family and running around insanely in their much bigger houses than ours. I do need to stress that Pippa has never been a moaner, crier or let on much when she is in pain - our experience has probably been best case scenario and hopefully yours will be too.

    The worst part was over the first+- 5 days there was a constant poop leakage and smell which followed her. Obviously since she couldn't wash for two weeks, some stayed on her skin no matter how many times we wiped her down. The possibility of this happening was definitely not stressed enough by the vet and I gave a one week grace period before I would have gone in for a follow up. On the fourth night I actually woke up to the smell of our skin, clothing, bed, pillows and headboard absolutely full of poop, that was the low point of the entire process, but from the next day all the leaking had stopped yay! Her dad spent a few nights on the couch during her recovery because we were scared of grazing her op sites if she was bunched in bed between us, and at some points the smells were just too hectic. She stopped her pain meds on day 5 and she was a bit depressed and sleepy but we were certain this was from the "come down" and not from pain. She has always been a fighter when taking meds so this was a twice daily struggle.

    We have always been babywipe wipers and tissue dryers when she poops so keeping things clean and sterile wasn't an issue for us. Once she winced a bit in pain on the first day home while we wiped but other than that, not a sound out of her. Even when we dabbed too hard or dislodged a scab or two our little soldier took it all in her stride. She has been so absolutely amazing and I can't be more proud of her. I really can't stress enough how great she has been and how easy we had it (her wanting to carry her toy around her body basically touching her spay site, multi-tasking single mom style, is on day two of being home).

    We were unable to keep her still and calm through the two week healing but nothing bad came from it which I think is a big concern for any parent having this surgery. And when I say she is active, I mean it... We also bypassed her daily teeth brushing and face wipe down for the first few days in case she fought us and got sore - this was a bad idea as she developed tear stains from missing a few nights. Other than that, I would suggest getting a waterproof mattress protector/plastic under the sheets if your pup sleeps in bed with you, LOTS of wipes, her favourite food and treats and a novel new toy that will keep her still and entertained and you will be good to go. We also got her steps up to the bed because there was no comfortable way of picking her up, which really helped her and made her feel very independent. If possible, I would suggest not changing her routine too much - if she sleeps in bed with you, don't crate her etc because that will cause a cycle of bad reactions. This seems obvious but in trying to find other people's experiences, I have read of many people doing this then wondering why their pup is crying when alone in a crate downstairs in the kitchen all night. I also ran out and got two sets of cheap bedding to get us through her recovery because we were going through our normal, pricier sheets like loo paper during the first few days (maybe add washing powder to that list...)

    Another thing we didn't feel was stressed by vet were the huge, thick scabs from the clamps on either side of her butt. We actually had no idea she would be clamped. These were a real eye sore & look terribly sore, given Pippa's skin issues we were so worried it was a reaction to something. On new years eve (about 1.5 weeks in) these fell off naturally and all that's left are two scars.

    On her 14th day, we popped via the vet and the nurse took her lip & spay stitches out (butt is dissolvable) and was happy with her progress. This was done at the back but must have been painful as our trooper came out shivering and wanting to be held and get the hell out that place. The good news is she got the go ahead to go back to daycare immediately after and the entire process has been forgotten ever since. Her hair is already all back On the behavioural side the only downer has been that she has gotten so used to seeing both dad & I within a few meters of her for two weeks that when we are in the next room and out of sight she goes on a huge barking spree and expects us to find her - she was never a big barker or expected us to find her (not her find us) before but she does have separation issues which I feel have now been reinforced since she obviously needed to be under our noses for two weeks. She has gotten better since going back to daycare so we are hoping it was just a phase.

    So we feel the operation has been worth it - no daily leaking, painful weekly expressions and no more scooting!!! She even made a friend with the other Frenchie having her spay the same morning and had a playdate this past weekend. Over the past week she has had what looks like a solid poop nugget, attached to her skin and all attempts to remove this has shown its quite attached to her and made her wince a bit. So I am calling the vet today and asking to come through for them to have a look and remove whatever it is. I am hoping it is not a messy stitching job that has caused a bit of skin to stick out beyond the sphincter. I am quite worried about this and the possibility of needing to go back under to have her skin snipped neatly (I am the worst worrier in the world). Other than that our little baby child has been better than ever and if your experience as been anything like ours, I would definitely recommend this procedure.

    (Please excuse the all-over-the-show typing)

    So very happy she is doing so well and everything went great with the procedure.... thanks for sharing her story!

    my sweet angel babies
    Nitschke 2004-2011 and Banks 2005-2014

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