What do you use for IVDD management??

Rusty’s Owner

Active member
Feb 11, 2022
272
177
Rusty went to the vet today, and she said he likely has IVDD, she showed us his ‘weak’ spot in his back and that’s what she thinks caused the scream the other day and liklely was back pain and fear not a seizure, but she isn’t 100% sure.
She thinks he peed himself out of fear and pain.
She did bloodwork which we will get back tomorrow, hopefully everything is ok in bloodwork.

He can still use his back legs but his back right food/leg takes longer to fix when she moves his foot around(he sometimes has his paw upside down-bottom of his paw facing up) which he does fix/correct himself but it isn’t as fast as his other leg.
But she said he is sore in that one spot, which has a curve on a X ray before(about a year ago she brought it to my attention).

This is not my regular vet, i know a vet who is my neighbor and she wanted to do bloodwork sooner to rule out any other issues. Since the appointment at my regular vet who we have gone to for 8 years, didn’t have an appointment until 1 week so on Tuesday I will take him to my regular vet for her opinion. In the meantime I wanted to make sure he would be ok and check bloodwork.

This is my biggest fear since I got Rusty. He is 3 years old, and is my best friend.

I never let him do stairs, jump on/off couch, or jump on anything. I carry him upstairs and downstairs, and put him on and off the couch, I have been doing this from day 1 in hopes of preventing IVDD, but unfortunately it didn’t work out like that☹️
The vet I seen today didn’t say to get a neurologist, but my regular vet I’m seeing on Tuesday might want to send him to neurologist but I’m not sure.

He was sent home with Metacam which I have never gave him for a long time cause he got sick on it and it is known to cause joint problems, and kidney issues and other side effects, for the pain and inflammation I always give CBD oil instead.
I hope I will never have to use it on him.

I never knew he was in back pain.

I have gave him some CBD oil for pain and inflammation tonight, and will continue.
Thankfully he can use his lags still, but I still fear that.

So my question,
What do you use to maintain the back health in your dogs with IVDD???

do you give CBD oil every day??
What other foods/supplements do you give them??

Do you give Omega 3 too? I’m considering Green Lipped mussel oil for omega 3(Safe Sea from Four Leaf Rover brand) as he is allergic to herring, doesn’t like salmon and is allergic to all other fish in fish oils.


Im also giving him bone broth, probiotics and his regular supplements he requires to maintain his urine to keep him from getting more crystals. All This he has been on for 1 year, no issues.


Rusty is my baby, and I will do anything to keep him in good health.
He is such a sweet, funny, affectionate boy!
He is the best dog I have ever owned, I love him to pieces!

If you have any info or tips that you have done or recommend for maintaining the back in a dog/Frenchie with IVDD??

Anything else I should be giving that would be beneficial???
I try not to use medications from the vet as much as possible because of the side effects.

Do they need to have MRI done to officially diagnose IVDD?? Can something fix this-surgery or therapy??

Anyone with experience or knows someone with this issue, please let me know what you use to support the back, and what supplements/suggestions that have helped.

Anyone see a neurologist for IVDD??

I would appreciate any feedback, advice, help!
 

Mavis

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2014
1,874
102
Rusty went to the vet today, and she said he likely has IVDD, she showed us his ‘weak’ spot in his back and that’s what she thinks caused the scream the other day and liklely was back pain and fear not a seizure, but she isn’t 100% sure.
She thinks he peed himself out of fear and pain.
She did bloodwork which we will get back tomorrow, hopefully everything is ok in bloodwork.

He can still use his back legs but his back right food/leg takes longer to fix when she moves his foot around(he sometimes has his paw upside down-bottom of his paw facing up) which he does fix/correct himself but it isn’t as fast as his other leg.
But she said he is sore in that one spot, which has a curve on a X ray before(about a year ago she brought it to my attention).

This is not my regular vet, i know a vet who is my neighbor and she wanted to do bloodwork sooner to rule out any other issues. Since the appointment at my regular vet who we have gone to for 8 years, didn’t have an appointment until 1 week so on Tuesday I will take him to my regular vet for her opinion. In the meantime I wanted to make sure he would be ok and check bloodwork.

This is my biggest fear since I got Rusty. He is 3 years old, and is my best friend.

I never let him do stairs, jump on/off couch, or jump on anything. I carry him upstairs and downstairs, and put him on and off the couch, I have been doing this from day 1 in hopes of preventing IVDD, but unfortunately it didn’t work out like that☹️
The vet I seen today didn’t say to get a neurologist, but my regular vet I’m seeing on Tuesday might want to send him to neurologist but I’m not sure.

He was sent home with Metacam which I have never gave him for a long time cause he got sick on it and it is known to cause joint problems, and kidney issues and other side effects, for the pain and inflammation I always give CBD oil instead.
I hope I will never have to use it on him.

I never knew he was in back pain.

I have gave him some CBD oil for pain and inflammation tonight, and will continue.
Thankfully he can use his lags still, but I still fear that.

So my question,
What do you use to maintain the back health in your dogs with IVDD???

do you give CBD oil every day??
What other foods/supplements do you give them??

Do you give Omega 3 too? I’m considering Green Lipped mussel oil for omega 3(Safe Sea from Four Leaf Rover brand) as he is allergic to herring, doesn’t like salmon and is allergic to all other fish in fish oils.


Im also giving him bone broth, probiotics and his regular supplements he requires to maintain his urine to keep him from getting more crystals. All This he has been on for 1 year, no issues.


Rusty is my baby, and I will do anything to keep him in good health.
He is such a sweet, funny, affectionate boy!
He is the best dog I have ever owned, I love him to pieces!

If you have any info or tips that you have done or recommend for maintaining the back in a dog/Frenchie with IVDD??

Anything else I should be giving that would be beneficial???
I try not to use medications from the vet as much as possible because of the side effects.

Do they need to have MRI done to officially diagnose IVDD?? Can something fix this-surgery or therapy??

Anyone with experience or knows someone with this issue, please let me know what you use to support the back, and what supplements/suggestions that have helped.

Anyone see a neurologist for IVDD??

I would appreciate any feedback, advice, help!
Hopefully, like with Petey, his IVDD will only be sporadic and not chronic. My only caution (as you already know), is giving him the Metacam. We manage Petey's episodes with gabapentin and rimadyl whenever it flares only. Could you try that when he seems "off"? You could also ask about giving him a permanent "maintenance" dose (kind of like taking ibuprofen every day for when we humans get inflammation), that would be low dosage and safe for daily use (with periodic bloodwork to make sure)?

Good luck. I know what it is to have a heart dog, even though you love all the others, too. Frenchies are very special and Rusty is an angel.
 

Rusty’s Owner

Active member
Feb 11, 2022
272
177
Hopefully, like with Petey, his IVDD will only be sporadic and not chronic. My only caution (as you already know), is giving him the Metacam. We manage Petey's episodes with gabapentin and rimadyl whenever it flares only. Could you try that when he seems "off"? You could also ask about giving him a permanent "maintenance" dose (kind of like taking ibuprofen every day for when we humans get inflammation), that would be low dosage and safe for daily use (with periodic bloodwork to make sure)?

Good luck. I know what it is to have a heart dog, even though you love all the others, too. Frenchies are very special and Rusty is an angel.

I hope so too about it being mild and not chronic.

I would use metacam as a last resort, only when there is nothing else available but j will always have CBD oil on hand for pain and inflammation for him like I do with the other dogs.
There is no side effects of CBD oil, and it does the same as metacam(anti inflammatory and for pain).

She said to give him metacam on the days he plays hard(but I would give CBD oil instead, he isn’t allergic to it).

I try not to give him any medications because all of them have side effects.
I will look into the potential long term side effects of those 2 meds you use on Petey for his episodes. Most medications make him sick(prednisone and tons of others we were given for him in the past), I will look into those 2 you use for Petey though.

Yes definitely, he is my sweet boy.

Thanks for your response to my thread, and support, it’s greatly appreciated and means a lot.
 

Cbrugs

Moderator
Staff member
Aug 19, 2013
3,910
137
@Cbrugs what is your thoughts on what I’m currently giving? What do you use for Jax?
Anything you recommend for maintenance?
So you say Lion's Mane is PROVEN to prevent paralysis in dogs with IVDD and keep the nerves, and spine healthy. Do you have a link to any studies? Because proven means it must actually have been scientifically proven at some point. I would love to see the studies that shows it is proven.

Like with any supplement, they CAN/MAY/COULD help with certain issues but not necessarily prevent something like paralysis from happening.

Jax has had IVDD since 2017 and he gets CBD oil, GLM powder, turmeric paste, bone broth, etc. but none have stopped another disc from herniating. And like with most supplements, it doesn't hurt to give them and if they help, then that's great.

I know a few people that are looking into PLDA - Percutaneous Laser Disc Ablation (PLDA) is a procedure for preventing thoracolumbar intervertebral disc herniation in dogs. I don't have any personal knowledge with it.

An exam alone can't diagnose IVDD. Only a MRI can give a proper diagnosis. Almost all Frenchies have some sort of spine deformities so an X-ray can't diagnose IVDD either.
 
Last edited:

Rusty’s Owner

Active member
Feb 11, 2022
272
177
So you say Lion's Mane is PROVEN to prevent paralysis in dogs with IVDD and keep the nerves, and spine healthy. Do you have a link to any studies? Because proven means it must actually have been scientifically proven at some point. I would love to see the studies that shows it is proven.

Like with any supplement, they CAN/MAY/COULD help with certain issues but not necessarily prevent something like paralysis from happening.

Jax has had IVDD since 2017 and he gets CBD oil, GLM powder, turmeric paste, bone broth, etc. but none have stopped another disc from herniating. And like with most supplements, it doesn't hurt to give them and if they help, then that's great.

I know a few people that are looking into PLDA - Percutaneous Laser Disc Ablation (PLDA) is a procedure for preventing thoracolumbar intervertebral disc herniation in dogs. I don't have any personal knowledge with it.

An exam alone can't diagnose IVDD. Only a MRI can give a proper diagnosis. Almost all Frenchies have some sort of spine deformities so an X-ray can't diagnose IVDD either.

Lions mane I came across the site over 1-2 months ago and can’t remember where I found it.

I know trying something doesn’t guarantee he won’t have any more spine issues. But like you said it doesn’t hurt to try.
But I will try to keep his spine good with the good food and supplements.
Does Jax get CBD oil daily?


I havent heard of PLDA, I will look into that too.
We see our regular vet on Tuesday and she might refer him to neurologist(was mentioned a year ago), but I can’t guarantee she will not change her mind.

Do they have to be under anesthesia for MRI to diagnose IVDD??

Thanks for your response! I appreciate it
 

Mavis

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2014
1,874
102
I hope so too about it being mild and not chronic.

I would use metacam as a last resort, only when there is nothing else available but j will always have CBD oil on hand for pain and inflammation for him like I do with the other dogs.
There is no side effects of CBD oil, and it does the same as metacam(anti inflammatory and for pain).

She said to give him metacam on the days he plays hard(but I would give CBD oil instead, he isn’t allergic to it).

I try not to give him any medications because all of them have side effects.
I will look into the potential long term side effects of those 2 meds you use on Petey for his episodes. Most medications make him sick(prednisone and tons of others we were given for him in the past), I will look into those 2 you use for Petey though.

Yes definitely, he is my sweet boy.

Thanks for your response to my thread, and support, it’s greatly appreciated and means a lot.
Hugs.

Gabapentin and Rimadyl are standard treatment for pain and inflammation here in the States. I don't know if they go by a different name in Canada, but please inquire about them. I only give Petey a half a dose of the Gabapentin at a time (nerve blocker for pain), because I prefer to resort to medication as little as possible.
 

Cbrugs

Moderator
Staff member
Aug 19, 2013
3,910
137
Lions mane I came across the site over 1-2 months ago and can’t remember where I found it.

I know trying something doesn’t guarantee he won’t have any more spine issues. But like you said it doesn’t hurt to try.
But I will try to keep his spine good with the good food and supplements.
Does Jax get CBD oil daily?


I havent heard of PLDA, I will look into that too.
We see our regular vet on Tuesday and she might refer him to neurologist(was mentioned a year ago), but I can’t guarantee she will not change her mind.

Do they have to be under anesthesia for MRI to diagnose IVDD??

Thanks for your response! I appreciate it
Unless there are scientific studies that show Lions Mane is proven to prevent paralysis, etc. I personally wouldn't be telling people it is proven.

I give the turmeric paste and CBD oil twice a day with breakfast and dinner. Jax also gets acupuncture and sometimes laser therapy. He has an acupuncture session this Saturday and that vet is also big on Chinese herbs, etc. so I will ask her if she thinks adding Lions Mane would be beneficial and to make sure would be no issues with giving it along with other supplements he gets.

Yes, an MRI requires anesthesia and for the dog to be put under. If there are no active symptoms of a herniated disc, a vet might not suggest a MRI quiet yet.
 

Rusty’s Owner

Active member
Feb 11, 2022
272
177
Hugs.

Gabapentin and Rimadyl are standard treatment for pain and inflammation here in the States. I don't know if they go by a different name in Canada, but please inquire about them. I only give Petey a half a dose of the Gabapentin at a time (nerve blocker for pain), because I prefer to resort to medication as little as possible.

Oh ok. I will look into it first before I ask the vet.

That’s how I think, I won’t give any medications to him unless it’s absolutely necessary and at the tiniest amount possible.
 

Rusty’s Owner

Active member
Feb 11, 2022
272
177
Unless there are scientific studies that show Lions Mane is proven to prevent paralysis, etc. I personally wouldn't be telling people it is proven.

I give the turmeric paste and CBD oil twice a day with breakfast and dinner. Jax also gets acupuncture and sometimes laser therapy. He has an acupuncture session this Saturday and that vet is also big on Chinese herbs, etc. so I will ask her if she thinks adding Lions Mane would be beneficial and to make sure would be no issues with giving it along with other supplements he gets.

Yes, an MRI requires anesthesia and for the dog to be put under. If there are no active symptoms of a herniated disc, a vet might not suggest a MRI quiet yet.

I will try to find that where I seen it about the lions mane, My vets know what he is taking and they said I haven’t even heard of lions mane, so Sounds like vets don’t really know it existed.

Do you find the acupuncture and laser therapy helps?? I was just told by someone today that laser therapy would be beneficial, and could help with the sore spot.
How often do you do laser therapy?
How often do you do acupuncture?

Ok that’s what I thought, but I was Hoping he wouldn’t need to be under anesthesia for it.

Did Jax stop using his back legs when he was first diagnosed??

Has he screamed out in pain during a flare up??

Well Rusty did show the symptoms other than not being able to use his back legs(that’s the only thing that he didn’t show), but because she knows he is sore there and thinks that’s why he screamed in pain and fear, and peed from being in Pain and fear.
I’m not sure if my vet will recommend MRI Or not but it really wouldn’t surprise me if she did recommend it.
 

Cbrugs

Moderator
Staff member
Aug 19, 2013
3,910
137
I will try to find that where I seen it about the lions mane, My vets know what he is taking and they said I haven’t even heard of lions mane, so Sounds like vets don’t really know it existed.

Do you find the acupuncture and laser therapy helps?? I was just told by someone today that laser therapy would be beneficial, and could help with the sore spot.
How often do you do laser therapy?
How often do you do acupuncture?

Ok that’s what I thought, but I was Hoping he wouldn’t need to be under anesthesia for it.

Did Jax stop using his back legs when he was first diagnosed??

Has he screamed out in pain during a flare up??

Well Rusty did show the symptoms other than not being able to use his back legs(that’s the only thing that he didn’t show), but because she knows he is sore there and thinks that’s why he screamed in pain and fear, and peed from being in Pain and fear.
I’m not sure if my vet will recommend MRI Or not but it really wouldn’t surprise me if she did recommend it.
Jax has full use of his legs. The only time he has ever yelped is 2 times when jumping onto the couch which was once in 2017 and this last time in January.

Right now we just do acupuncture once a month as maintenance and laser therapy every couple of months. I’ll do it more frequently after surgery and then go to once a month.

The MRI is what determines the severity of the disc herniation and if surgery is recommended. If issues aren’t consistent and causing constant pain, some do conservative treatment of strict crate rest with meds for 6-8 weeks to get the inflammation down. Jax has needed surgery every time.
 

Rusty’s Owner

Active member
Feb 11, 2022
272
177
Jax has full use of his legs. The only time he has ever yelped is 2 times when jumping onto the couch which was once in 2017 and this last time in January.

Right now we just do acupuncture once a month as maintenance and laser therapy every couple of months. I’ll do it more frequently after surgery and then go to once a month.

The MRI is what determines the severity of the disc herniation and if surgery is recommended. If issues aren’t consistent and causing constant pain, some do conservative treatment of strict crate rest with meds for 6-8 weeks to get the inflammation down. Jax has needed surgery every time.

Was yelping the only sign of needing the surgery when he needed it? Or just thru a flare up?

Do you find the laser therapy works really good? Is it better than acupuncture?
Would it be sore from it healing with the laser before it gets better.


How many surgeries has Jax had??
Did they need to do an MRI before every surgery?

What signs did he show other than yelping that he needed surgery??

If you don’t mind me asking, what was the approximate cost for the surgery??
If he has had more than 1 surgery, what did each surgery cost? Just curious as I seen it can be expensive but haven’t heard of the cost.

I really wouldn’t want to put him on strict crate rest for that long, but I also don’t want to put him under anesthesia unless it’s absolutely needed.
But I am really worried about him, and the IVDD has always been my biggest fear for Rusty.
He is only 3 years old.

Thank you for your response in answering my questions/concerns, I appreciate it.
 

Cbrugs

Moderator
Staff member
Aug 19, 2013
3,910
137
Was yelping the only sign of needing the surgery when he needed it? Or just thru a flare up?

Do you find the laser therapy works really good? Is it better than acupuncture?
Would it be sore from it healing with the laser before it gets better.


How many surgeries has Jax had??
Did they need to do an MRI before every surgery?

What signs did he show other than yelping that he needed surgery??

If you don’t mind me asking, what was the approximate cost for the surgery??
If he has had more than 1 surgery, what did each surgery cost? Just curious as I seen it can be expensive but haven’t heard of the cost.

I really wouldn’t want to put him on strict crate rest for that long, but I also don’t want to put him under anesthesia unless it’s absolutely needed.
But I am really worried about him, and the IVDD has always been my biggest fear for Rusty.
He is only 3 years old.

Thank you for your response in answering my questions/concerns, I appreciate it.
Jax was first diagnosed at 4 years old in 2017. He went to daycare one day and came home and you could just tell something was off. Then he went to jump on the couch and yelped but then seemed fine. But then he started having neck spasms. Took him to the ER and they thought he just pulled something at daycare. It started getting worse, and he couldn’t get comfortable and the spasms were more frequent and he would tremble. Back to the ER and I showed video. They kept him for a neurology consult. Ended up doing an MRI and he had a herniated disc in his neck and did surgery. That whole cost was just under $10,000.

11 months later, he started having neck spasms again. Too him to the neurologist. We tried crate rest and a low dose of Prednisone. But once we started tapering off the prednisone, the spasms came back so he had another MRI and he had herniated another disc in his neck and had surgery. This one was also just under $10,000. He came home and I knew something wasn’t right. They had told me after surgery, he felt so good and bolted out of his crate. After a few days at home, I brought him back because I could tell he was in pain and wasn’t recovering the same as the first time. They did another MRI and he had hurt himself when he bolted and more disc had protruded so he had another surgery on the same discs. They gave me a discount on that one and that all cost over $5,000.

All had been good until January 2022. Again, I could just tell something wasn’t right. He wouldn’t come onto the couch unless he was locked up. Then one day, his back end started trembling and he yelped when he tried to get on the couch. I just knew it was another disc so to the ER he went. Because of his history, they got him in right away for a neurology consult. They could tell there was definitely an issue and again, based on his history, we did the MRI and this time it was his lumbar area that herniated so we did surgery. That was just over $12,000.

If a dog has IVDD, and is having a flare up, strict crate rest is a must. Even after surgery, they are on strict crate rest for 6-8 weeks. It has to be done.

I don’t know if laser therapy or acupuncture helps Jax but it doesn’t hurt, so I do it. I know people have good results with paralyzed dogs.

In all instances, Jax’s discs were pressing on his nerves and he needed the disc material removed. Not all cases are like that. He will always have a risk of herniating other discs. There is no cure for IVDD. Their “cushions” in their discs dry up which causes the herniations. And once they dry up, there’s no fixing them.
 
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