Kicked Out of Doggie Daycare

[Pope]

I'm so disappointed and feeling a little lost with this. I picked Pope up from daycare today (he goes once a week to release some extra energy that daily walks don't do), and the lady told me that she feels bad for taking my money any longer because Pope just ends up sitting alone in time out for the majority of the day! We've been hoping that he would grow out of his rough play, but no signs are pointing to that yet. He has played rough since he was just a tiny puppy. The small-dog park doesn't like him being there anymore, and we have to put him in with the big guys. Even then, he terrorizes some of them! He jumps up and grabs their ears and necks. If they have any loose skin around the neck, Pope will grab on and pull/shake, or run alongside them with their skin in his mouth. He doesn't let go until someone physically intervenes. I don't think he's trying to be aggressive at all, because that isn't his attitude, he is totally just playing but it is GETTING OUT OF HAND. I have no clue how to fix this! We've tried spraying him with a water bottle the moment he latches on, he stops immediately, but it doesn't prevent him from starting. We've tried a stern NO, stops him but doesn't prevent him.

HELP! Someone has told me that it's "just a bulldog thing, it's how they were originally bred". That's fine and dandy, but still not acceptable. Please help, it's incredibly embarrassing and I'm nervous he could accidentally end up hurting a smaller dog if he were around one. I don't agree with this tactic, but I'm seriously beginning to consider a lite-vibration collar to be able to more automatically distract him when he begins rough-housing.

 

[Cbrugs]

Oh no! That makes me so sad. That might help. Jax usually goes to daycare once a week as well for the same reason and they actually put him in with the big dogs because that is who he likes to play with and he can handle it. I've taken him to Frenchie meet ups before and he usually ignores the Frenchies and goes for the big guys.

Have you tried obedience classes with him?

 

[Tgirl]

He sounds like a little fireball. I agree with looking into obedience training. Also, is he neutered?

 

[Alice Kable]

I wish Central IL was close to NE OR, Pope and Buster could wear each other out! That is exactly how Buster and Ruggles play. Ruggles is 8 & 1/2 yrs old and pretty much keeps up with the roughneck play. Buster is usually the instigator and shows no mercy. Buster has played with other dogs who are taken back by his roughness and I know if we had a doggie day care here he'd be in time out all of the time. I don't know if a trainer can teach "gentle" during play.

 

[davidh]

They do play rough and some rougher than others. Just keep on him with the training. He will eventually out grow it.

 

[Pope]

He sounds like a little fireball. I agree with looking into obedience training. Also, is he neutered?

He is! He holds his own and even some of the bigger dogs are afraid of him. The daycare he went to put him with the big dogs, and apparently he's still too rough. It just makes me sad for him, but also really frustrated. We have actually never gone to obedience training! Besides this issue, he is a really good dog, so we never really thought there was a point. Like Alice said, I have a hard time imagining what a trainer would do for that though. When he's playing he's running all over the place, so do you just chase him? And by the time you reach him, it's too late to correct at the first bite.

Not sure if this makes a difference, but we got him from a pretty questionable breeder. She had all the paperwork, but something just felt off. Anyways, apparently his tail kept growing as a pup and they ended up cutting it. While they already had him under anesthesia for that, they neutered him at 8 weeks! I've been wondering if that has had any effect on his hormone levels.

I've thought that he would learn naturally through older dogs correcting him, but he honestly doesn't seem to get it. They'll bark and nip at him warning him to stop, and he just stands there staring at them then keeps jumping on them.

 

[Tgirl]

With obedience you teach them commands with practically no distraction until they do it reliably, then you start adding distractions and working your way up. Ideally when he started that you could call him to you right away. Maybe at that point you could work on some commands and redirect him. When he gets rough you could verbally scold him and when he is good you could praise him. I don't know, I'm no trainer lol. I'm just tossing out ideas. Obedience helps with all kinds of issues though. Definitely worth a try. From the way it sounds, Frenchies have their own way of playing and other dogs often don't go for it. Poor adorable Frenchies!

 

[2bullymama]

I wish Central IL was close to NE OR, Pope and Buster could wear each other out! That is exactly how Buster and Ruggles play. Ruggles is 8 & 1/2 yrs old and pretty much keeps up with the roughneck play. Buster is usually the instigator and shows no mercy. Buster has played with other dogs who are taken back by his roughness and I know if we had a doggie day care here he'd be in time out all of the time. I don't know if a trainer can teach "gentle" during play.

So true --- this is the same way Banks and Cheli played... now, it is how Cheli and Lambeau play. We tried everything to settle Cheli down, heck Banks nearly ate him a few times, but nothing stops him unless we physically correct him.

 

[Squishy Walnuts]

Sadly, this sounds like Wally. He's had 2 levels of training and I still can't get him to calm the hell down around other dogs. He has no manners. When he plays with my BT Uma they are fine since she can handle his rough play but other dogs usually get scared &/or frustrated with him. I keep trying different techniques but nothing sticks permanently. Other than that he's a really great dog so I can't complain too much.

 

[Alice Kable]

It is all about play with these guys! Buster would rather play than eat!

 

[Jakeyjake]

I understand your frustration. I would be disappointed too thinking you are doing something good for him and it backfires. My Stella hung from Jake's jowls non-stop when she was younger! And Jake's best friend is an 80 lb. Am. Bulldog. He bites at her feet and jumps at her face. It helps if we get them a toy and then they will focus on the toy and play tug of war. She was here this weekend and Jake was so intently focused on playing with her that he peed in the kitchen! That has never happened.
I have been doing some training with my dogs recently and I honestly feel that they listen to me a lot better. It may be worth a try so that he will look to you for more direction. My dogs are so tired too after a training session and it is also so stimulating for their brains.

 

[winginit66]

Looks like you can find everything on the interweb... I found this with a simple Google search. I have NO idea if it's true or not, but might be worth discussing with your vet. And that is the only way our 3 play...

Male Dog Neutering - all you need to know.
•Loss of testosterone production at a very early age, as a result of desexing, may result in extremely immature development of masculine characteristics and a significantly reduced body musculature.

• Early neutering may result in retained juvenile behaviours inappropriate to the animal's age later on.

 

[MickieBlue]

Perhaps instead of obedience class you get a consultation one on one with a dog trainer. My boys daycare has training as an option. They might let you bring him into daycare with the trainer to work on his issues and give pointers.


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[Cbrugs]

Perhaps instead of obedience class you get a consultation one on one with a dog trainer. My boys daycare has training as an option. They might let you bring him into daycare with the trainer to work on his issues and give pointers.


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This is a good idea. When Jax was a puppy we did classes at Petsmart. Honestly, I was surprised he graduated lol. When he was a tad older, I had a trainer come to my house (she is through the daycare he goes to and knew him) for three sessions. This time the focus was on whatever we wanted it to be on. Unfortunately when we started to working on recall, she ended by saying "good luck with this one, do not let him off a leash."

 

[Pope]

Looks like you can find everything on the interweb... I found this with a simple Google search. I have NO idea if it's true or not, but might be worth discussing with your vet. And that is the only way our 3 play...

Male Dog Neutering - all you need to know.
•Loss of testosterone production at a very early age, as a result of desexing, may result in extremely immature development of masculine characteristics and a significantly reduced body musculature.

• Early neutering may result in retained juvenile behaviours inappropriate to the animal's age later on.

That's a really interesting article, thanks for sharing that! I've been wondering if him being neutered so young would affect his mental growth. He is a pretty lean and tight frenchie so I think it's affected his physical growth. Hopefully it's just slow maturity, not impossible.

 

[hannah]

This sounds exactly like Banksy..... I was hoping it was just a Puppy phase....... ugh LOL

 

[blushy]

It's def a frenchie thing...

Mine bite eachothers cheeks so much while wrestling sometimes they bleed! (Not a lot lol)

Titan had my SILs chihuahua to play with yesterday and guess how he played? Tackling, biting her cheeks .. YES! Her tiny chihuahua cheeks! And her neck, he was SO easy and gentle besides the mowing her over when he got zooming? But the biting was still there.

Edit: Isabelle is also the rough play. She bites much harder. I use a cup with coins to combat her behaviors, it works very well. I also have my guests use it for when she goes into psycho frenchie excitement and jumps on people and basically mows them off my couch cause she loves people THAT much. It helps everyone who comes over have more confidence on being the "leader" rather than being panicked with "omg this is their dog what do i do?" And then I have to deal with that "aw okay girl it's okay love you too isa aww so cute so good girl calm down" and it's like PLEASE SPARE MY SANITY AND SHAKE THE DANG COIN CUP ONCE!

Unfortunately Titan can't hear. I'm trying a spray bottle or water gun. But haven't actually tried yet. I tell him "NO" with sign language and a firm mad face lol. Doesn't help because it's hard to correct BOTH dogs at once with 2 different techniques at the same time but he's much more gentle to begin with. He's my goofy boy.

 

[Squishy Walnuts]

Love the 'firm mad face'. lol! I tried the cup of coins on Wally. All it does is annoy everyone in the house except him. *sigh* Wally doesn't bite hard but he never knows when to stop. Crazy Frenchies.

 

[blushy]

Love the 'firm mad face'. lol! I tried the cup of coins on Wally. All it does is annoy everyone in the house except him. *sigh* Wally doesn't bite hard but he never knows when to stop. Crazy Frenchies.

Everything I read said use body language like looking extremely happy with "good" etc etc so I try to look as mad as possible LOL!!

 

[shortstuff]

I keep picturing Titan's adorable smiley face with those massive ears, and mommy angrily signing with an exaggerated grumpy face... must be too funny to watch!


On another note... Pope's story is exactly why we stopped taking Bisou to the dog park. At the dog beach, she's so distracted by people and the water that she doesn't go after other dogs much, but at the dog park she scares the crap out of the other little dogs. She's not being aggressive per se, just likes to get in other dogs' faces and play rough. She and Shasta play so rough at home that Bisou doesn't understand not every dog wants to play that way. She is ONLY gentle with my family dog, a small terrier mix who is getting grumpy in his old age, and that's it. We've talked about taking her to the big dog side because that's the size dog she prefers and the size dog that can keep up with her... but I'm so afraid of her triggering a big dog's prey drive and it's bye bye Bisou. For us poor folks who can't afford a trainer at the current moment, what are some other ways to socialize?